Author Topic: A.S.T.R.A voice pack  (Read 35922 times)

Tkael

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 49
Re: A.S.T.R.A voice pack
« Reply #30 on: February 18, 2017, 07:10:22 PM »
Thanks Gary. This will make a lot of people very happy.

Gary

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2824
Re: A.S.T.R.A voice pack
« Reply #31 on: February 18, 2017, 07:28:00 PM »
Since now you can have multiple, prioritized profiles, have you guys given any consideration into breaking up your profiles into, 'categories'?  Possibly have a profile that has stuff that doesn't ever change, and another that has stuff that always changes.

Also, when you, 'include' other profiles, you can adjust which one has priority over the other (with your current profile having highest priority).

Just a thought.
« Last Edit: February 18, 2017, 07:34:43 PM by Gary »

Tkael

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 49
Re: A.S.T.R.A voice pack
« Reply #32 on: February 18, 2017, 10:24:11 PM »
That would certainly make things easier. The recent ASTRA updates, however, do touch on a lot of categories.

sutex

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 91
Re: A.S.T.R.A voice pack
« Reply #33 on: February 20, 2017, 05:37:30 PM »
I haven't even attempted to work the latest HSC profile into my ED Profile, for me it's still in the 'pull your hair out' category 

Gangrel

  • Caffeine Fulled Mod
  • Global Moderator
  • Full Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 216
  • BORK FNORK BORD
Re: A.S.T.R.A voice pack
« Reply #34 on: February 20, 2017, 06:58:32 PM »
I haven't even attempted to work the latest HSC profile into my ED Profile, for me it's still in the 'pull your hair out' category 

The way in which I have suggested for some people to do it, is to have the custom commands in one profile, set that one as the active one, and then use the include commands from another profile option, and then choose the voicepack profile.

This way, Custom Commands get precedence if there is a clash, and they are not erased on an update.

Side note: With the change now of being able to copy commands (when called by name) that include other commands to another profile, it means that it should be a lot easier.

Side note 2: The HCS profiles (ASTRA, EDEN, VERITY, ORION, ALIX), should now be pretty much "run by name" for the commands. So even if you only copy over the *spoken*/*customised* commands to the "custom profile", they should still work fine. This is because you are not relying on the GUID of the command (which can be different between your profile and mine, even though we might well make the command exactly the same way) as the identifier.

Side note 3: And because the base commands (as in the ((commands)) are not changing on the HCS voicepacks profiles, doing it the above method means that when the profile does get updated, you just overwrite the existing ASTRA profile and relink. And your changes are already there.

Yes, it takes a long time to get a profile sorted out (in terms of the getting the custom commands into their own profile), but you only have to do it the once... once you do that hard work... it then becomes a 10 second maintenance job

sutex

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 91
Re: A.S.T.R.A voice pack
« Reply #35 on: February 20, 2017, 07:20:18 PM »
Ok .. when's the Video Tutorial..lol.. thanks , will have a go  :)

Gary

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2824
Re: A.S.T.R.A voice pack
« Reply #36 on: February 21, 2017, 12:00:53 PM »
Quote
That would certainly make things easier. The recent ASTRA updates, however, do touch on a lot of categories.

Something I can do that may be quick and easy (famous last words) as a first-round update would be to just a do a quick check behind the scenes to see if commands that are going to be overwritten are different action-wise.  If they have the very same actions, highlight in blue or something.  It would cut down on some of the clutter.

Mr Talkalot

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 12
Re: A.S.T.R.A voice pack
« Reply #37 on: March 13, 2017, 12:11:27 PM »
I think VA is extremely good at it's job, and there is no need to reinvent the wheel here.
What is needed is a companion app to VA, let's call it the "Profile Analyzer"
It would compare two profiles, and everything not conflicting would be Cut and paste to a Temp working file
that keeps a line count or place mat with open spaces for what is conflicting between the two profiles.
Next it would again compare the conflicting items and those found to be equal to each other would then
be cut and paste from one profile to the Temp working file, and the other found to be equal would be deleted,
from the second profile. The next run would look at empty space in second profile and everything across from
the empty space would be cut and paste with a merge function to the Temp working file.
At this point what is left in both profiles are the True conflicts which need to be worked out.
Chances are that these conflicts are caused by updated files, each being the same except for the updated content.
Each side would then be compared by Date Stamp, the newest would be kept, while the oldest would be deleted.
The newest of these would then be cut an paste merged into the Temp working file.
The Temp working file then becomes your new profile, and should not have any conflicting problems,
Only lacking the actions which rely on what is left in the "Lost Commands List"
What is left is what you have to deal with.

Is my proposal feasible or just wishful thinking?

sutex

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 91
Re: A.S.T.R.A voice pack
« Reply #38 on: March 13, 2017, 02:40:16 PM »
I think VA is extremely good at it's job, and there is no need to reinvent the wheel here.
What is needed is a companion app to VA, let's call it the "Profile Analyzer"
It would compare two profiles, and everything not conflicting would be Cut and paste to a Temp working file
that keeps a line count or place mat with open spaces for what is conflicting between the two profiles.
Next it would again compare the conflicting items and those found to be equal to each other would then
be cut and paste from one profile to the Temp working file, and the other found to be equal would be deleted,
from the second profile. The next run would look at empty space in second profile and everything across from
the empty space would be cut and paste with a merge function to the Temp working file.
At this point what is left in both profiles are the True conflicts which need to be worked out.
Chances are that these conflicts are caused by updated files, each being the same except for the updated content.
Each side would then be compared by Date Stamp, the newest would be kept, while the oldest would be deleted.
The newest of these would then be cut an paste merged into the Temp working file.
The Temp working file then becomes your new profile, and should not have any conflicting problems,
Only lacking the actions which rely on what is left in the "Lost Commands List"
What is left is what you have to deal with.

Is my proposal feasible or just wishful thinking?


Wishful thinking or not , Players need a system where I can control what is imported,  And modified commands can be protected, so importing a NEW HSC pack , can't over write protected commands

In short anything that makes importing new ASTRA or and HSC Pack easy over your current working tweaked profile

TheThingIs

  • Global Moderator
  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 278
    • HCS Voicepacks
Re: A.S.T.R.A voice pack
« Reply #39 on: March 13, 2017, 02:59:18 PM »
Or put your custom commands into a separate profile and include the cmds from Astra. That way they are protected. Seems to me you are using the wrong method for customising and will struggle greatly every time it's updated. Not allowing cmd's to be overwritten just because you have customised them also lends itself to a whole heap of problems, especially the way the new packs are written. If you don't update all the commands then you are liable to end up with one very messy and unusable profile.
The Singularity profile - One profile to rule them all and at HCS we bound them ;)

You see, TheThingIs, eventually you'll be allright.

sutex

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 91
Re: A.S.T.R.A voice pack
« Reply #40 on: March 13, 2017, 03:32:05 PM »
Or put your custom commands into a separate profile and include the cmds from Astra. That way they are protected. Seems to me you are using the wrong method for customising and will struggle greatly every time it's updated. Not allowing cmd's to be overwritten just because you have customised them also lends itself to a whole heap of problems, especially the way the new packs are written. If you don't update all the commands then you are liable to end up with one very messy and unusable profile.


At the moment I CAN'T put my custom commands into a separate profile in an EASY way .. which is why my profile is messy after years of adding and tweaking what is there, in my ASTRA Profile.

To be able to open my current ED profile and tick all the commands Ive made or modified , and then import them into a separate profile , 'without errors' is a dream I have often , and write about ..lol

Gangrel

  • Caffeine Fulled Mod
  • Global Moderator
  • Full Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 216
  • BORK FNORK BORD
Re: A.S.T.R.A voice pack
« Reply #41 on: March 13, 2017, 05:03:59 PM »
Or put your custom commands into a separate profile and include the cmds from Astra. That way they are protected. Seems to me you are using the wrong method for customising and will struggle greatly every time it's updated. Not allowing cmd's to be overwritten just because you have customised them also lends itself to a whole heap of problems, especially the way the new packs are written. If you don't update all the commands then you are liable to end up with one very messy and unusable profile.


At the moment I CAN'T put my custom commands into a separate profile in an EASY way .. which is why my profile is messy after years of adding and tweaking what is there, in my ASTRA Profile.

To be able to open my current ED profile and tick all the commands Ive made or modified , and then import them into a separate profile , 'without errors' is a dream I have often , and write about ..lol

Why not post your profile up (or a section of it) so we can have a gander and see what can actually be done?

sutex

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 91
Re: A.S.T.R.A voice pack
« Reply #42 on: March 13, 2017, 05:38:05 PM »
LOL... you really want that nightmare ..

Remember theses ((RS sound something)) where removed and the wav / mp3 was change , and then later the ((sound)) things are back  If your confused , then so is my Profile .. just so you know

Gangrel

  • Caffeine Fulled Mod
  • Global Moderator
  • Full Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 216
  • BORK FNORK BORD
Re: A.S.T.R.A voice pack
« Reply #43 on: March 13, 2017, 06:14:33 PM »
Yep, I would like to see what you have actually done that would make it so hard to break apart

sutex

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 91
Re: A.S.T.R.A voice pack
« Reply #44 on: March 13, 2017, 08:47:38 PM »
Yep, I would like to see what you have actually done that would make it so hard to break apart
Its not the breaking up , it's the putting back together .. The sub commands are not copied across..

shall I just ..pm you a Vap link ?

Gary

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2824
Re: A.S.T.R.A voice pack
« Reply #45 on: March 13, 2017, 10:53:02 PM »
I'm actually working on the, 'copy with subcommands' routine.  The icky part is when there's duplicate-named commands, either on their own or within multipart/dynamic commands.  If the duplicate(s) is(are) within multipart/dynamic commands, you may not want to overwrite... or maybe you do.  Maybe you want to just suffix with a '-1'.  Just seems like there's a gob of things that need warnings, so, what is probably going to happen is you'll get a list of commands where duplicates exist and if you opt to copy anyway any duplicates will be suffixed with, '-1'.  You'll need to go in and straighten that out, but at least everything gets copied over.

sutex

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 91
Re: A.S.T.R.A voice pack
« Reply #46 on: March 13, 2017, 11:41:26 PM »
Maybe a New Sticky Pinned

Work in Development on Profile Importing Exporting Management HSC system Interface .. etc .. :)

Gangrel

  • Caffeine Fulled Mod
  • Global Moderator
  • Full Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 216
  • BORK FNORK BORD
Re: A.S.T.R.A voice pack
« Reply #47 on: March 14, 2017, 03:42:14 AM »
Yep, I would like to see what you have actually done that would make it so hard to break apart
Its not the breaking up , it's the putting back together .. The sub commands are not copied across..

shall I just ..pm you a Vap link ?

This is where the "export profile" and keeping the "reference commands" box (bottom left of export screen, where you choose which ones to export) is handy.

This will mean that at least if you DO move a command that requires something else, at least it gets moved there.

To be honest, looking through your profile, it isn't as bad as you think it is. There IS a lot of cruft in there, that doesn't necessarily need to be there, and I also spy a few duplicate command phrases (so not sure which one gets used):

Deploy the fighter
Deploy the fighter; deploy fighter 1
Galaxy map on;Show galaxy map;Open galaxy map;Galactic map on;Open galactic map;Stellar cartography
Galaxy map;Show galaxy map;Open galaxy map;Galactic map on;Open galactic map <--- this one also plays the a "closing map" sound file.

Silent running off;Disable silent running;Open heat vents;Open the heat vents;Open the vents
Silent running off;Disable silent running;Open vents;Open heat vents;Open the heat vents;Open the vents <--- this one has more logic code in it

There are also duplicate commands (not using same trigger, but to do the same thing), but they do it in different way (your Audio for example, has 2 different logic systems for volume control, but they both rely on nircmd for example).

And then there is the ASTRA stuff, where you have imported the new profile into the existing profile (which has caused its own chain of issues, where some commands have lost their reference to the command that they are meant to be running (landing gear (just by itself) has an "Unknown command" error in it)

sutex

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 91
Re: A.S.T.R.A voice pack
« Reply #48 on: March 14, 2017, 06:24:55 AM »
cruft ..lol .. yep have to sort though it one day :)

Gary

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2824
Re: A.S.T.R.A voice pack
« Reply #49 on: March 14, 2017, 09:16:27 PM »
Ok, so I went around the moon again with this thinking it would change and ended up in the same place.  Below, I've outlined what's been done, why it's been done the way it has been and show why doing this is not an easy (good) idea. 

What it is...
VoiceAttack uses GUIDs to uniquely identify commands.  To execute a subcommand, you pick a command from a list (or, choose a command by typing its name... I'll save that for later).  The, 'execute another command' action maintains its reference by id because the referenced command can be changed over and over.  I think pretty much everybody gets this, so I'll move on.

Why it is...
In the very beginning, the id was unique to the created command, and stayed with the command even on export.  What happened was commands got exported, changed up a bit and then reimported with the same ids.  An, 'execute another command' action that retains a reference to that command via id now doesn't know what command to execute because now there are multiple commands with the same id.  This immediately caused problems, so, what had to happen to keep everything working was that when commands were exported, everything that gets exported had to have a new id.

The problems...
Profile1 has 2 commands:  A and B.  Very simple:  A executes subcommand B when it is called.  B is set up by reference (not by name)
Profile2 also has 2 commands: X and B.  Very simple as well.. X executes subcommand B when it is called.  B is also set up by reference (not by name).

Possible solution 1:
Copy A from Profile1 to Profile2.  Subcommands MUST come as a package, due to identifiers.
Warn user:  Profile 2 has a conflict: B exists in both places.  Do you want to overwrite B? 
User selects, 'Yes'
B is overwritten with a new id in Profile2.  In Profile2, A can execute B.  X can no longer execute B because B's id is now different.  We could go another step and assume that we are keeping the same Id, but we may find out that B was actually just NAMED the same and contained totally different actions.

Possible solution 2 (mostly the same as 1):
Copy A from Profile1 to Profile2.  Subcommands MUST come as a package, due to identifiers.
Warn user:  Profile 2 has a conflict: B exists in both places.  Do you want to rename B with, '-1'? 
User selects, 'Yes'
B is copied as, 'B-1' with a new id in Profile2.  In Profile2, A can execute B-1.  X execute B.
There is now B and B-1, both are really the same command.
User needs to fix references or live with duplicated commands.

There are other scenarios... these are just 2 that make this a deal breaker.

What's been done to help:
VA now allows you to copy commands that execute subcommands if the subcommands are executed by name (and not by reference).

The solution for complex profiles:
Switch to executing subcommands by name instead of by reference.


Again, I've dug this one out a couple of times before, and each time I think I'll come up with a way that will ease the process, but it doesn't.

Tkael

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 49
Re: A.S.T.R.A voice pack
« Reply #50 on: March 16, 2017, 07:18:24 PM »
1. Maybe this (I'm hoping I understood your prior post correctly)?

Copy A from Profile1 to Profile2.  Subcommands MUST come as a package, due to identifiers.
Compare conflicting subcommands.
If subcommands have identical content:
   B is overwritten with a new id in Profile2.
   No prompts to user are required.
If subcommands contain different content / actions:
   Warn user:  Profile 2 has a conflict: B exists in both places and contains actions that do not match A. Do you want to rename B with, '-1', overwrite B, or skip? (bonus points if action lists can be shown side by side for comparison by the user)
   User selects rename
      B is copied as 'B-1' with a new id in Profile2. 
      In Profile2, A can execute B-1.  X execute B.
      There is now B and B-1, both are really the same command.
      User needs to fix references or live with duplicated commands.
   User selects overwrite
      Warn the user. The old B will be entirely gone / non-recoverable. Are you sure?
      If 'Yes'
         B is overwritten with a new id in Profile2. 
         Identifiers in X are reassigned to the new id.
         In Profile2, A can execute B.  X can execute B.
         The old copy of B is gone.
   User selects skip
      The selected command is not copied.
      Any other commands being copied at the same time are not interrupted.

2. The solution for complex profiles:
   Switch to executing subcommands by name instead of by reference.
   Is there a good way to do this in bulk? Complex profiles may require switching a lot of commands.

sutex

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 91
Re: A.S.T.R.A voice pack
« Reply #51 on: March 16, 2017, 08:45:13 PM »
Need diagrams with pictures  A to B if C is next to D ...lol